Risk & Resolve
The Risk & Resolve Podcast is your go-to resource for insightful conversations at the intersection of leadership, business ownership, and the insurance industry. Hosted by Ben Conner and Todd Hufford, this podcast dives deep into the challenges and opportunities that leaders face in an ever-changing world.
Each episode features candid discussions with business owners, industry experts, and thought leaders, exploring topics like innovation, risk management, and the strategies that drive success. Whether you’re an entrepreneur, executive, or insurance professional, you’ll gain actionable insights and inspiration to navigate today’s complex business landscape.
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Risk & Resolve
What Happens When Purpose Drives Business with Jeff Mosley, Chick-fil-A Operator
Jeff Mosley shares his 28-year journey as a Chick-fil-A operator, revealing how his path from ministry to marketplace leadership created a culture of care that transforms lives far beyond the restaurant industry.
• Transitioning from 15 years in ministry to finding purpose in business through Chick-fil-A
• Starting at a low-volume mall location and not writing a profit check for three years
• Managing teams of 100-120 employees across two locations with remarkably low turnover
• Creating benefits beyond paychecks: college tuition programs, financial literacy, and personal development
• Viewing fellow operators as partners rather than competitors through an abundance mindset
• Navigating COVID challenges with innovation while experiencing 28% business growth
• Learning from Truett Cathy's legacy and principles that built Chick-fil-A into America's third-largest restaurant company
• Empowering team members and fostering alignment with purpose as key leadership strategies
• Developing youth through mentorship and helping them find their calling
• Building leadership pipelines that have launched seven team members into becoming operators
"I tell you what, I can do it alone, but why would I want to? There's just something so powerful about engaging with others... When we're aligned as a market, my goodness, there's nothing we can't do together."
You're listening to Risk and Resolve. And now for your hosts, ben Conner and Todd Hufford.
Speaker 2:Welcome to another episode of Risk and Resolve. I'm your co-host, ben Conner, along with Todd Hufford, and today's special guest is Jeff Mosley. Jeff has over 35 years of experience in the hospitality industry, with the last 28 years being as an operator for Chick-fil-A with two locations under his leadership season in my life, where I was working with my dad very regularly and daily and we frequented the local Chick-fil-A and that's where we connected with Jeff and over several Chick-fil-A sandwiches, I've gotten to know Jeff over the course of time, so that was a really special experience. Also unofficially, todd and I believe that we may be the two largest grossing customers at the Chick-fil-A at Keystone at the Crossing.
Speaker 1:Pretty sure I beat you Ben. So yeah, together we're-.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there was a period, I think Todd had Chick-fil-A every single morning. So, anyway, we're excited to connect with Jeff and talk about his story today. So, jeff, welcome to the show.
Speaker 3:Well, thank you so much for the opportunity of being here today. What an honor. It's really awesome just simply to be with you today. And again, yeah, it's been. You've been coming for a year. Both of you have been coming for years and I remember literally probably the last 20 years cause we've been open about 23 now and seeing your family come and having times at the table when you and your dad would come, and it was just very special and always encouraging to see you and thank you for both for supporting the brand and being a part and being a huge investor in Chick-fil-A. Absolutely, thank you.
Speaker 2:Filet, absolutely, thank you. Well, early in my career I remember you and my dad talking about, like at that time, like the recession, and no eight, no nine, and just asking each other questions and you know I was just kind of keeping my head up saying, you know, listening of, you know, two successful men, uh, kind of just sharing some stories of what they're seeing. So that was pretty cool. We'll talk plenty about your experience with Chick-fil-A, but wanted to rewind the clock. You've been in the hospitality industry for 35 years, so so what did it look like? What did you do?
Speaker 3:What were you doing before the opportunity at Chick-fil-A came? Yeah, thank you for asking For me, and this is really something that is very important to me with, as I, as I care for my team is after I graduated from college, I went to a small Christian school and in that back in the day way before the internet, way before all of that, it was crazy and computers, honestly, it was interesting because back then, if you went to a Christian school and you were a pastor for Jesus, you were a pastor and so I had some musical gifting. You know that the Lord loved to sing and lead worship and so therefore, I had this path towards ministry and it was great. But there was always something in me that I love doing that on Sunday, love leading worship, but there's always something that I always look to those in business and really wanted to be a part of that, and so for me it took a while to about 15 years after college. I was a part of several different churches, my actually the reason that the way that I found my wife, actually that we met, was actually touring. We were based in Austin, texas, in a vocal Christian band and we toured and sang in churches and did some albums with them and we were singing partners and we got married after the tour. So we met singing and then we went into again more ministry.
Speaker 3:There's always something in me, though, that, as much as I enjoyed that Monday through Saturday, I really wanted along for something different, and it took me literally 15 years full-time in bivocational ministry to fit. And God was very kind and my wife was very understanding because she married a pastor that our path really continued to grow towards that there really is a ministry in the marketplace. And so we went down a path of bivocational ministry, very still involved in churches and around the country. But in Denver I, as a bivocational pastor, need to work in the hospitality industry and waiting tables and managing and that, but also leading worship and helping some smaller church plants. But through that process, really, the Lord was really really kind just to guide me and this is really your passion and there's really a calling in it. You can do all the things that you want to do in terms of music and worship and teaching, which I love to do. But there's always something inside me, even as a child, I always thought man, it'd be great to own a restaurant. It would be great to own my own business, and so it was simply a journey and that's that's. That's something that, from my experience, that I really want my team as they're growing up and maybe they don't have. You know, today we have a lot of great career assessments and and that folks can really identify their, their gifting, and which is great today, and we really want to help our team do that. You know, I hope it doesn't take 15 years, like me, like it, like it did for me, although it was great, it was fine, it was part of the journey, but to help them accelerate that, that that ability to find their purpose in calling and it could be a full-time ministry, that's awesome, but there is a ministry in the marketplace, and so, again, we just didn't have you know the IT and you know informatics and all that. Back in the day, it was pretty much ministry, which is fine, but that was my journey, and so, from that, though, I was part of a full-service Italian chain in Denver also Louisville, kentucky Learned tremendous amount about the hospitality industry, and that was called Grazani's. It was just a great, great experience.
Speaker 3:My wife and I were very, very involved through that whole process of bivocational ministry, of doing mission trips and for me, I was actually preparing a group of young adults, teens, to go to the country of Haiti. We were doing a drama and we had a lot of preparation and through that, when they would come for practice before our launching and going on that mission trip, they would bring their Chick-fil-A cups. I'm like man, I just learned about Chick-fil-A. And I'm like man, great values, really, really great company. And I'm like, where's the Chick-fil-A at? I don't understand, cause we were actually in Louisville, kentucky. It was across the river into Southern Indiana, and they were like, oh, you know, it's a Tree Mall. I'm like, well, wow, that's great, I didn't know that. Well, who's your operator? And then, well, we don't have one, wow.
Speaker 3:So went back down that path and it was a very, very low volume opportunity at Chick-fil-A. Back in 1997, chick-fil-a was different in terms of sales volume. Today, we're the third largest restaurant company in America, over 3,000 restaurants nationwide, internationally too. We're in Canada, puerto Rico, we're in the UK and a $20 billion company. Today, 97, we weren't quite there. We hadn't even hit a billion dollars in sales, and so applying for that and getting that opportunity was just really awesome for me and again, it just really started the whole journey with Chick-fil-A, which, for me, has been it's been so life-giving and it's been so such an incredible experience because of the values of the company. They say you know you can be in business for yourself, but not by yourself. That's really true.
Speaker 3:I love the support that Chick-fil-A provides Incredible. But also I have the opportunity to express the entrepreneurial side of how I want to do that. We have a beautiful foundation with our corporate purpose and it's really there's two parts of that stewardship and it's also positive influence. I love that and so we get to build on that. But then I get to express that in my own individual way. And but then I get to express that in my own individual way and that's the thing that keeps me.
Speaker 3:I love to get up and go to work every day because I get to spend time with a great team. I get to impact, strive to impact our community, spend time with, with families, like like you described, ben, and I love what we get to do. And, like I said, this fall will be my 28th year and I love what I get to do and I'm so grateful for this opportunity. And, just like in any business, crazy, challenging, a lot of crazy stuff coming at us in this economy, trying to grow it. At the same time, I love what we get to do. We get to express that every day, and every day is different in business, as you know.
Speaker 1:So, Jeff, did you grow up in Texas Is that home?
Speaker 3:No, my dad was in the service and so I was born in Germany and we traveled quite a bit. We lived in about five or six different states before I was even in kindergarten and unfortunately my parents separated and divorced when I was pretty young. My dad left. That was a part of my journey too, of growth and kind of working through challenges as a child. And when my mom remarried she also married again a gentleman who was in the service and never been married before, and he was a great man.
Speaker 3:And we moved to Mississippi and so I spent my middle school and high school years there and after graduating definitely returned back to Florida, where we had settled in South Florida. But I went back to college in Florida and so my church experiences led me to Louisiana and different places, back to Florida, but being able to tour with that band Eternity and meeting my wife, and that was basically so I was in Texas for a year. My wife had already been with the group for a couple of years prior, so Texas was a small step. What was the college that you attended? I went to Warner. It's a sister college of Anderson University. It's called Warner Southern. It's Warner University now Very, very small Christian school, but it was a great experience there, I've been there.
Speaker 2:Have you really Wow Interesting, yeah, I helped out with the women's basketball team in indiana westland. Is that right? We uh had a winter tournament in florida that we certainly didn't complain about wow, that is so interesting.
Speaker 3:Yeah, when I went, there was a very, very tiny school. They've really grown a lot, really taking the kind of the indiana westland model, and they've really got. They've really expanded their, their base. I actually went back to indiana westland got my master's later on, so there's a nice connection there. But yeah, that's so interesting. Very few people in the more southern yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Were you in louisville when the opportunity or when you began the application process with chick-fil-a?
Speaker 3:yes, we were. Yeah, we had um at that point. Uh, we had three kids and um and I was really looking for, you know, the. The restaurant industry is really great. I love the hospitality industry, but for most companies it can really be pretty brutal in terms of that, the amount of hours and um, and that was such a huge appeal to you know, when I was working for that company, I mean literally there were. It was just a lot, you know, not getting home till two or three o'clock in the morning when you had to close the restaurant. So for Chick-fil-A man, that was just amazing. Having Sunday off was absolutely incredible. And you know we're not open till. You know my staff doesn't get home at two or three o'clock in the morning. You know we close at 10 o'clock and so that was just one nice incredible benefit that I know at least I'm going to have Sunday off and that's going to be amazing because the industry can be really really tough. It really can.
Speaker 1:Did you know at that point, sitting there in Northern Kentucky, southern Indiana, that you would have the opportunity to be placed in Indianapolis, or was that still a big question mark at that time?
Speaker 3:Oh, absolutely. We didn't even know that there was part of the whole developing plan. For us. Again, green Tree Mall was a very, very low volume opportunity. But as a matter of fact, when I went through the interview process the HR team was like I don't know that a family of five can make it there, and they were very, very open that it was going to be very hard. And literally we didn't write a profit check for three years there. Chick-fil-a has a certain base that everybody makes, but we never wrote a profit check there. It was very low volume. And so when the opportunity opened up for Castleton Square in 2000, that was just like wow, this is going to be a huge opportunity for us. And so in 2000, we moved to Indianapolis and that was again just part of the whole excuse me developing plan. For us as we worked, green Tree was a great experience. It was tremendous. As a matter of fact, that store is gone. Now They've opened freestanding locations, but it was a great.
Speaker 3:I mean, honestly, the small beginnings in business. That was just one part of the story. That's like. I'm so grateful for it. I mean today Chick-fil-A is opening with just tremendous volumes with new locations. But I'm grateful that we had that opportunity that you know, every chicken sandwich was really important Every customer and they are today still was really important Every customer and they are today still. But it was. It was just very meaningful the the early beginnings because really it's really was true at Kathy, the founder of Chick-fil-A. That was his, his story, and we can I know we'll we'll talk about the impact that he has had not only on our company but on me and in our market. But I don't regret those. I'm really grateful for the three years that we had there, because you just had to grind and it was very difficult and it was also just a tremendous blessing.
Speaker 1:And wasn't the first mall-based Chick-fil-A at the Greenbrier. It was. And you were at the Green Tree some 400 miles north of that or something you know the Chick-fil-A history yeah 1968.
Speaker 3:North of that or something. So kind of an interesting parallel there. You know the Chick-fil-A history. Yeah, 1968, chick-fil-a went from this tiny restaurant company which really was one store at, you know, the Dwarf House that Mr Cathy opened in 1946. And then, yeah, in 1968, for them to open First mall location, and again, true it was. Mr Cathy was just such a pioneer you know they didn't have food courts back in the day for him to be the first to to work with mall management teams to get food in the malls. That was pretty unique. Yeah, absolutely yeah.
Speaker 1:By 2000,. The, the franchise you stepped into was in the food court at Castleton Square. Is that right, absolutely.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:There was a location at Castleton, not in the food court. Do you know much history on?
Speaker 3:that location? Yeah, I've heard about it. I don't really know a lot of specifics. I guess it was a double-decker, it had an up top, absolutely, and it's really interesting. So we have, like I said, over 3,000 locations. Castleton Square is actually store 21. I believe it Store 21, which is really interesting. In 1980, they opened 100 locations or so and a huge expansion, and that's a big part of Chick-fil-A's story of the growth and the economy at that point and the funding of our corporate office and how the whole corporate purpose of stewardship and influence was created, because it was a really tough moment for the leadership at Chick-fil-A because of that growth and really trying to do that, the uncertainty of what the future was going to look like, and that's been such a pivotal piece for us that we have this anchor of an incredible corporate purpose to rely on that. First off, we have what Mr Cathy went through. It was just incredible. But yeah, you're right, I mean store 21, that was just amazing and it's still a great open 1980. It's pretty amazing.
Speaker 1:Was that a corporate store? Was there a franchisee associated with that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, Great question. It was a franchisee. The corporate stores are primarily in Atlanta that have with the Dwarf Grill and with all of those that grouping of restaurants. But the majority of those locations around the country are going to be franchise led.
Speaker 1:Well, I've got great memories of what I now know was Store 21, which was the original Castleton Square double-decker, and it was mostly through my grandmother and here's why my mom having two young kids, she would opt for the drive-thrus. Well, back in the day that was your kind of prototypical restaurant in a mall which, as we talked about the Greenbrier, was kind of like. The mall operator said we don't want our apparel stores smelling like food. I mean, that was right there as you walked in. It wasn't any kind of food court or anything, but my grandmother would buy the sandwiches by multiple at a time and she'd stick them in her fridge at home and so most of my early memories of your sandwiches were cold believe it or not.
Speaker 1:So I've been enjoying warm sandwiches for the last three years, oh my goodness, that's a great story.
Speaker 3:As an adult.
Speaker 1:But one other funny story before you did your renovation here at Clearwater, I was in line. It was dinnertime and I pulled in, I'd left work and I'd gotten in line. It was that place where you could still pull out of line. Now, once you're kind of in, you're kind of committed, and I was sitting there and I was getting ready to make my order and I just kind of hit myself upon the head and I said, oh my gosh, and I realized that I had been there for breakfast and that we had had food catered in for lunch and it was Chick-fil-A and I had pulled into Chick-fil-A for dinner. I was about ready to have your meal three times in one day, and so I pulled out a line and said I probably better find something else. Oh, my goodness, that is beautiful.
Speaker 3:We love that and most of our podcasts you may have seen me take a drink, here I am. Oh, look at you. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:It's that proverbial red and white cup. When people dress up like me in the office, they wear a red jacket and they carry around a Chick-fil-A cup.
Speaker 3:Oh, I love it. That is awesome. You guys are raving fans. Thank you so much. We are amazing.
Speaker 1:How many team members does it take? Now you've got two locations, two full side, full freestanding locations. Now how many team members does it take to keep those guys running?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's interesting.
Speaker 3:You know, again, every store is going to be a little different.
Speaker 3:We have a lot of full-time employees and we have about a good probably a good range is going to be 100 to 120 per location, and sometimes we're able to do that with less because we do have a lot of full-time employees and we do have an army of teens that come in and help us too, which is really awesome to be a part of that. Yeah, back in the day, like going back to my green tree days, I probably had less than 20 employees total. It's amazing, right, and so what we have today being open at, you know, at at six, 30 and closing when we do, yeah, we, it's pretty much, you know, two to three groups of shifts that are coming in to supplement and help us. So, yeah, it's it's, it's it's in that a hundred 120 range. So, yeah, it's in that 100 to 120 range. Some operators have more than that, some have less kind of based on their mix of part-time and full-time employees Does that officially make you the leader of the largest youth group in the state.
Speaker 3:I think it probably could. We're probably up there. Yeah, I need to take a look at that, definitely.
Speaker 1:What percentage of those are under 20 year olds?
Speaker 3:Oh, we have quite a few. Actually, it is kind of interesting, you know, the kind of the mystery we've been talking about this week. It's kind of funny that we have so many siblings that work at Chick-fil-A. You know, they came in but what seemed to be a great job, great part time job, when you were 16, they're still there after 15 years. Now they're in leadership. I have some folks that have been with me for over 20 years, 23 years. It's been really amazing.
Speaker 3:And again, many of those started when they were, yeah, this is going to be a summer job. Next thing, you know, you've got to be careful. Right, you've got to be careful. You're going to be here a while and we love that, and again, we just try to create so many different opportunities for them. Again, we are in the fast food industry, but I choose not to. We're just not a fast food restaurant company. I love Chick-fil-A yeah, it's in the segment, but it's not. We just don't want to be fast food Absolutely, and so we're trying to create those benefits. We just don't want to be fast food Absolutely, and so, you know, trying to create those benefits.
Speaker 2:How do? How does your staffing model differ, then, from fast food, cause you talked about a quite a bit of full-time employees? That seems to me. It may be just, I don't, I don't know any better, but that seems to be unique. I wouldn't expect that from like other fast food competitors.
Speaker 3:if you will, yeah absolutely, but you know we do have the you know just the lowest turnover. We have the highest retention in the industry, even among operators. It's amazing. There's probably only three or 4% on the operator level of folks that leave, whether it's retirement or finding something else. I mean it's very, very high in terms of operators. But even our team members and leaders we have a very, very strong retention program.
Speaker 3:I think a lot of that is and again, the thing that we work so hard as leaders with my leadership team, is alignment with who we are and if we really are doing this, if we are fulfilling our mission of being the you know the most, the world's most caring company, and we are aligned with our purpose and our and our and our and what we stand for is pretty good when we're on our game, and I'm not saying we're good, I'm saying the culture is good. What Mr Cathy gave us is amazing that, if you really feel cared for and so within that, though, you know we, we we do try to provide a lot of benefit, whether it's insurance, whether it's 401k plan, whether it's life skills, you know. Whether it's, you know someone who comes. We've had a variety of different people come from Iraq and in the Middle East and Latin American countries, and all that and English as a second language has an offering that we provide. You know have in the past, whether it's a fitness program to encourage them in their health. Trying to respond, especially after COVID. As you know, covid has really been a challenging time. Coming out of it, I still feel like we're we're dealing with some of the kind of the holdover issues of isolation and mental health issues and how do we create care for them? I just think you know All the things that we can try to do to create those moments of care. One of the things that we do is is really challenge them, as I talked about, you know, helping them in their careers. We have a partnership with point university and Atlanta fully online program but you can go and get your degree for free. Wow, I pay for your tuition. We've had, we had, our first graduates with a, an MBA, and also, you know, getting your business degree. But it's helping them find their purpose and their passion and helping them take advantage of these opportunities, like in investing.
Speaker 3:You know we talk about it a lot. You know about starting today, the power of time and interest, what that can look like for you. Do you want to be a millionaire? Because you can, and what you can do with that and how you can impact them. If you start today, my goodness, if you started at 18, don't start at my age, when you started at 18 and doing that, that would be amazing. What about? Four more years from now, you can have your degree. Well, what if you just want a two-year degree? That's great, we have tuition for you. You know. Do you want to bet? You know we've done finance classes. You know. Do you want to get on a budget in this economy, as hard as it is? Can we help you with this? And again, it's always a challenge because not everybody wants to do that. And that's OK.
Speaker 3:I would love, for I would love to write a. You know this development plan that everybody is going to follow and they and they don't. Some people, you know, they're just not ready for that. But for those who are, let's launch, let's go. But you know the cool thing about um, the, the thing that's the most fulfilling for me is that when you hear about the college interview or the, the, the fortune 500 interview that our former team members have, and they come back and go. You know what? It's crazy how much they want to talk about my time at Chick-fil-A, yeah, whether it's getting into Notre Dame, and they want to talk about my scores, my academics, but they really want to talk about that or that job at Salesforce. They really wanted to talk about my time at Chick-fil-A. So the thing that we would love, and again, even with our individual, again we have this great corporate purpose of stewardship and positive influence. And as we layer that, what the things that are really important to me, that we have our own working values that we talk about.
Speaker 3:And again, I'm constantly, we're constantly talking about this, about alignment. If you align yourself with these, these principles, in time will make you, when you're a parent, a better parent. They will help you be a better spouse. They will help you be a better spouse. They will help you be a better citizen by caring. It's having that what true Kathy gave us, that my pleasure attitude, that ability to serve. If you, if you embrace what we're talking about here, you can have a really incredible life. And again, it's just, but there's, you know, sometimes there's not buy-in and sometimes there is. I can't control what you can't control with your team of you, know you can talk about. You can have a whole benefits list right of what you want to do or the principles. If you live these, you can really have an incredible life. And yet there's got to be that inner motivation, you know.
Speaker 2:Well, it seems like the law of attraction has really applied because you have low turnover, what you just talked about.
Speaker 3:You didn't mention compensation once that Chick-fil-A is offering and locally you're offering.
Speaker 2:People are showing up for that, not just a J-O-B.
Speaker 3:I think you're right. I mean, the compensation piece is, I think, very, very important, because they're not going to stay if it's not a living wage, right. But I do think there's something very special about if we can get beyond the grind, because life is a grind at times. Right, work is a grind. As much as I love what I get to do right now, you know it's a grind, it can be a grind, but if we can take that and again, as long as we're, and that's why I think the leadership challenge that we have is connecting to the purpose. The leadership challenge that we have is connecting to the purpose, if you can, because you can either see yourself as a janitor wiping tables down, or you can see yourself as I am creating an environment of care, and what I get to do here, yeah, it's sweeping and it's wiping down tables and it's running food and it's refreshing beverages and it's doing all that you can either. Again, it's all about perspective, right, and it's the same, I think, with every one of us in your industry and my industry that we can either see this as a grind. We can either see this as these are tasks. Either I'm a fast food worker or I am creating an environment of care, right, and it's just really interesting, even even from the those in the kitchen that are breading that hopefully craveable sandwich. They can either say, you know, I, I just I just bread chicken, or I am, I'm not just making a sandwich, I'm making a difference, and and that sounds really. I think it sounds really good. It sounds really hard, though, right, and that's our job as leaders. How do we continue to inspire that and create that In moments like last night, when I went to the restaurant and they're doing the best they can and we can't.
Speaker 3:We cannot ring in food, we cannot, and we have folks that are looking at us. So what do you do? You can send them away or you can go. We are happy to serve you whatever we have, and we'll take a bit of a loss, but it's actually an investment. You want to? Number one, I can't charge you and that's fine. We're going to give that to you and our team is seeing that as we model that, and then they're going. Oh, it's just not about the money. So, kind of going back to your question about why would they stay so long, I think it's a really important one that we need to really stay focused on. I think it's simply that commitment. The pay is really important. I think the benefits are important, but I think it's how we make them feel.
Speaker 2:Well, you want to be competitive and pay, but you're also not, you know, like a lot of fast food restaurants. You're not like chalking your front window full of hey, it's $18 an hour, and then if someone else is $18 an hour, they're like, oh, scratch out the zeros and put 1850. Like that's not the value offer. Certainly you have to be competitive and you want to be competitive, but everything else is why people stay.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 2:That's awesome, you know it's interesting and you mentioned even both of our businesses. But just thinking, what you experienced last night is and just for context, we're recording in mid-June and there was a big storm that just ripped through Indianapolis last night with just really high-powered winds, and so your restaurant was having a hard time just even taking orders. So the context of that. So we are a lagging indicator, if you will, in the insurance business that our team is taking a lot of calls today and it's one thing to talk about like an insurance policy transaction, but today is the day that our team has the honor and opportunity, when someone calls in, that we get to show up and we get to guide them. We get to tell them you know what they need to do.
Speaker 2:We get to be that source of confidence when, like if a tree fell on someone's house, like that's a really bad day, that's a very bad day. In fact, probably a day in 20 years from now, someone will say you know, tell me about an experience in your life. It's like, oh, a tree fell on my house. We get to show up and really be a calm, confident, guiding individual in that person's journey. So if it were about selling policies and insurance, nah, but it's when it's caring for and showing up in life's significant moments, like wow, like that's what's up. That's really cool, I think it's awesome.
Speaker 3:I think one other thought and just what your team is doing today has been. This thought has really hit me this week when I've gone to other retail spots and I go back and go okay, how do we want our guests to feel today, right? How do we want our team to feel? We want our guests to feel today, right, how do we want our team to feel? But you know, your team is very focused on the fact of that, leading with empathy and dealing with that, because I think that's something for us in our industry and probably for you, honestly that we have a competitive advantage if we execute who we are, because first it starts with our team. How, as a leadership team, are we making our team feel that's really what hospitality is? How do you make them feel, do you make them feel cared for? And then we can turn and do that for our guests.
Speaker 3:You know those folks that literally so many last night, just like you guys, are experiencing with not having a power at your house. Today they're coming. They're like we came here because we don't have any power. We need to eat. I'm like it's awesome. I'm not sure how we're going to serve you, but we're going to find a way Right, but how do we make them feel we can send them away empty and hungry and they need a place of of rest, and that's one of the things that I appreciate, that Dan Cathy true at Cathy's son used to talk about that restaurants, and really your business too, can be places of restoration, you know, and that that's just so important and, man, that's just a challenge, that's just such a leadership challenge for us to create that environment that first off is the team being cared for and then can we turn and pivot and really provide that care for our community and our guests. It's just, it's a huge calling no-transcript.
Speaker 1:Let's assume you've been invited to a 5,000 attendee gathering of youth not affiliated with Chick-fil-A Right. But they've said, hey, this is an operator in Indianapolis, indiana. He's over the last 20 years. He's overseen over 1,000 youth. He's over the last 20 years. He's overseeing over a thousand youth. If you were to give these 5,000 attendees a bit of encouragement with what you're seeing out of them and what also, what would you implore them either to start doing or continue doing? How would you pour into those youth today if you were invited to that large gathering of 5,000 plus young people today?
Speaker 3:I love that. That's a great question, thank you, awesome question. I think it really comes down to taking advantage of opportunities, as I shared, more than just in the investment space of starting now. But why not start now in other areas of your life, in preparation? I think about the kind of dad you want to be, the kind of spouse you want to be, the kind of mom you want to be, the kind of wife you want to be. Those are all those things. Start today. I think about the kind of person that you want to have in the marketplace, that you want to be today. It doesn't have to be four or five or 10 or 20 years out. It's what can happen today. This is all we have in this moment. I think I would encourage them on a lot of things.
Speaker 3:I think that life hits us with a lot of resistance. Steven Pressfield talks about that that in order to be successful, that you're going to have to have a resolve, you're going to have to have the ability to be resilient. I think you can be exceptional at your age, right now, if you do these things and that's, first off, understanding that life is going to be a challenge. There is resistance, that's going to come, but if you persevere and you go invest in yourself, but if you persevere and you go invest in yourself, if you can have a growth mindset, I just think that there's there's so much today of creating, and I didn't really necessarily have this when I was 18 or 17. But the hope that your life is going to continue to improve, you know, I mean there's just so much in that. You know, I think about all of our experiences. I think about my experience that you know my, my dad leaving when I was 10 and then later being for him. You know, having been married five times and and it was just really a just a sad life that he lived out. And the reality for me is, at 18, I can, I can do this differently, and my wife and I have been married, for we're going to be, and it's going to be 40 years before we know it. We have three adult kids in here that live in Indy that I'm just so grateful for being a dad.
Speaker 3:It doesn't matter where you start, it's how you end, and there are so many principles of if you apply today, today is the day. That's all you have today. So I think I would just encourage them to, to finding their calling and finding and that's going to be. It may take time to do that, but to find people that will help you in that and mentors in that. And to read and to listen to podcasts and to develop yourself and to again establish those values. What are those things that are going to be significant to propel you to your future.
Speaker 3:I think it's really finding that and part of it, like I shared at the first part of this, that it took me about 15 years to really figure out my calling, that there was something special in the marketplace, that it wasn't necessarily what I was trained to do in biblical studies as a 22-year-old, but today it just grows. I think another part is just being patient with yourself. I think it's also just developing the skill set of finding the answers. I think education is really. A college degree is really important. The reality, true, kathy never went to college. He was incredible. Jim Collins the Jimmy Collins, the president of our company that took us from, I guess, maybe 40 million to a billion dollars in sales never went to college. But it wasn't say they wasn't educated, wasn't that then? That's not saying that he wasn't brilliant, because both of those men were and and and so I think that there's just so much to unpack with those individuals, with those teams, to really capture the calling, the path for growth, and to really combat that whole part of resistance, because resistance is going to prevent you from wanting to go to college, it's going to prevent you from saving, it's going to prevent you from being the best that you can be, because it doesn't matter how you were raised.
Speaker 3:There's something very, very redemptive For me. There's a redemptive purpose in following Jesus and when I look back on my life, I'm just amazed at how kind that God has been to take the things that I was so discrepant in, that I was lacking in. But he doesn't keep you there. And you know, one of my favorite you know, biblical characters was Joseph. If you think about Joseph's story, it's incredible in Genesis that, having been taken from his parents, from his dad, and going on a path and the betrayal and the accusation and living in prisons, to ultimately being the greatest businessman in the world, to the point that he told the accounting team at the end of his business journey stop taking notes, stop accounting, because we have too much. And it's just amazing to me that God can do that. You know the things that were intended for evil sometimes in our lives when we're a youth. God has an incredible redemptive purpose and I would just encourage every one of those individuals to come get employed by Chick-fil-A, because we would love to be on that journey.
Speaker 1:What are they doing? Well, those that have been through your organization. You look at them, they're sub-20. If you were to say this group, gosh, they're sub 20. If you were to say this group gosh, they do this one thing really well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's good. I think it's alignment that they really understand what we're doing, our purpose. This is always a challenge when I've had, when I think about all the leaders that I've had over the last, you know, 35 years, and those that have been able to thrive and those who have struggled and that are no longer with us. It's the alignment piece Because, man, we talk about this so much right now. You don't drift to excellence, you don't drift to something really compelling, and we have to fight the drift. We're fighting the drift right now in our business. It'll be something that it's not a destination where we go wait, we did it. Nope, it's. Every day is a new day because we have the opportunity to drift, we have the opportunity to not show up, we have the opportunity, or we have the opportunity, to really engage, and so I think to, to to stop the drift and to, um, to really ask for help from each other. You know, one of our working values is helping others, and what I mean by that is that there are two questions Um, can I help you and will you please help me? If we did that today, it would be amazing. Will you help me get better? Will you help me and I'm. That's my question for my team, but that's my, but that's their question, hopefully for me. How can I help them? But how do they help me get better? And that's just.
Speaker 3:I just think that that's just those who have been so successful, because it's really been a blessing. You know, matter of fact, Monday I'm going down to to celebrate with one of our leaders because he's graduating as an operator and we've been privileged to have seven of our leaders that are operating stores today. Wow, that's great. So I think for those who but that's not to elevate them over the leaders that I have here, that's not to elevate them over the leaders that I have here, but that's just an example that we have so many leaders that I'm so grateful for in our business that necessarily won't be operators they could but they choose that. I love what I get to do but, to answer your question, I think it's that it's the connection to the purpose and it's a connection to their calling that has helped them sustain it. When life gets really hard and the business gets really difficult and we get, and just I think that's, that's simply the answer for us is alignment.
Speaker 1:So on the one side it's alignment. Let's go the other end of the spectrum and these are still the people that are doing. Well, what's the one thing that you would implore them to? Either stop doing or they need to start doing to get better. So this is kind of the deficiency side of the parenting, the coaching, the team building.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think again, I think it goes back to the drift and I think the people that that know that that haven't been able to, we couldn't. We had I had to make a decision that we can't work together any longer because you've drifted to a point, because it's a tug of war of values, it's a tug of war of culture. And even with our you're talking about that awesome army of youth, if we're, if we're not daily creating those, those guardrails of this is who we are. They will write the policy for you today. They will write the new standards today and what they wear and what they say and how they do it and and and I get that this is human nature for us to drift towards that. It's it's our job as as as a leadership team, to guide them gently and lovingly. But this is who we are, because, if not, you're going to have a whole new set of culture. We are because, if not, you're going to have a whole new set of culture. That's not my pleasure, it's all about me and and that's just really important.
Speaker 3:But for those who let's say that that are still with us, that that aren't fully bought in, that that's our daily task, that's, that's my leadership journey that's my leadership task is, is, and honestly, my one word for this year is alignment. I mean it is that's where we're at, because it is fighting the drift and cause. It's so good when we can really fulfill our purpose. And it gets really rough when we go rogue and we, out of our own brokenness or out of our own personal needs, whatever that is, that we're no longer and again, I love it when we're in that. But that's the journey. It's not a destination, it's not something that hey, we got there and we've found the code on culture. It's just constant. I mean, I think about Jesus had that with his disciples constantly going guys, no, that's not what we're doing, we're doing constantly. And he and they were like 24-7 together, right, 24-7. Absolutely.
Speaker 2:We get eight. That's right. In your journey as an operator, do you have regular opportunities to get together with other peers, other operators? So how frequent is that? What does that look like? Have regular opportunities to get together with other peers, other operators, to? So what? What is? How frequent is that? What does that look like? What, what, what is the setup?
Speaker 3:and and what do you typically experience at that? Yeah, absolutely, I think it's a great question. So one of the things I really do love about this that I think is a by-product of the culture of positive influence and stewardship is, on a monthly basis, every other month, we have design meetings that we get together for an afternoon and we and we kind of unpack, or a morning we just kind of unpack, we have an agenda and we do that. I mean, last week I went and, on my own, went to see two other operators in the market because they're just crushing it in a certain area of the business that I really wanted to see. The thing again the thing that I really love about other companies that have been a part of that there was really a scarcity mentality that, hey, if I'm successful, I really don't want to share that Right, and Chick-fil-A is completely different. On that, I mean I can call somebody who's number one in the drive-through in in the country and and they're free to yeah, come see me, come, let's talk, let's get our teams together, let's do that. I love that. You know, we're actually taking an operator trip next month. Actually, we're going to North Carolina to see a market there. There's tremendous, a great mindset around of just continuous improvement and a willingness to host people. Other teams come to Indy and we'll host them. We're constantly sharing ideas. I really love that. I think again, that's just a huge part.
Speaker 3:I think what Chick-fil-A has done corporately, that we're not in business, we're in business for ourselves, but not by ourselves. I mean, first off, I don't think anybody understands in our company. I don't think. I don't think any any. No one understands an operator like an operator. I'm sure it's very similar to your company. I don't know the challenges that you're facing. I don't. I don't know from unemployment, retention, profitability, I don't know that. So to be with other operators and to understand that, and I am so grateful. But it's a very intentional to your point, it's a very intentional discipline that not all operator teams are similar. Some guys are very independent and they see themselves potentially, I guess, could be competitors. Some guys are very independent and they see themselves potentially, I guess could be competitors.
Speaker 3:We've been over 20 years. We've been very intentional about hearing each other's stories initially and then loving that and loving each other and caring. There's a deep love and really devotion to each other. A sale or a team member. Hiring them is that is not. Uh, I'm simply not going to do that. I'm not going to take another person's team member, I'm not going to take a sale.
Speaker 3:The relationship I have with other operators I mean, we are surrounded, especially the crossing, we are surrounded with Chick-fil-A's, which is great, but it's also difficult, right, our trade areas are getting smaller and so there's a, there's a human part of that can be. You know, I can feel very competitive with those guys. They are competitors, but they're also my brothers and sisters. Honestly, they're very, I'm very, grateful. It's different, it really is. It's like nothing I've ever experienced before in terms of knowledge share, in terms of information, in terms of support. Honestly, I think that they've been there in the joys of my life.
Speaker 3:After COVID, my wife and I both lost both sets of our parents. They lived beautiful lives in their 80s and 90s and it was amazing when I looked out at the funeral and to see operators there unexpectedly Didn't have to, but they did, and that's the kind of relationship that I love so much about this, because the time I get with another operator is very important, because they understand, they get it, they get how hard it is for every transaction, they get the pressure that we have. I mean one of the cool things about Chick-fil-A amazing things about Chick-fil-A they're not a company in terms of the leadership that we have. I mean one of the cool things about Chick-fil-A amazing things about Chick-fil-A they're they're not a company in terms of the leadership that you're hoping that they'll lead. I mean they're, they're, they're thinking you know what's the company going to look like 10, 15, 20 years from now, and they're, they're very active. The challenge is keeping up with that because there's so much new innovation that they're investing in with us. There's so many things that we could be doing.
Speaker 3:At the same time, we have a lot of challenges locally. We have a lot of challenges with with customer. You know sharing customer base with other. You know we have so many chicken competitors. You know, just up the street We've got some new chicken chains coming in, so that I'm sure be a factor of impact, new chicken chains coming, and so that'll I'm sure be a factor of impact, and it seems like every restaurant now has some kind of form of Southern chicken sandwich that they would love to take the focus off of Chick-fil-A.
Speaker 3:So good luck. Yeah, well, thank you, but and not to mention inflationary issues, that you know it's it's, it's a challenge. So that part of the relationship I think is just it's so critical if we didn't have that. And plus we have a national conference that we get to go to and we just had an operator retreat that we just went down to French Lick and that was amazing, brought some outside speakers in, and so the support that Chick-fil-A provides, but also we have a group of operators that are committed to being together which is it's life-giving.
Speaker 2:It's really good, awesome. Well, you know they say what that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. I like it so for those, for those other chains trying to get some of that Chick-fil-A magic through their, their efforts.
Speaker 3:I appreciate that we just have. We've got a lot of work to do to just keep that food craveable and remarkable experiences, and with that army of youth.
Speaker 2:Well, you talked about the partnership at the corporate level and how they're looking out for the business, and you've also mentioned a couple of times the Cathy family and Truett and Dan. If you could share a little bit about your experience in your interactions with Truett and Dan or whomever from the Cathy family, and how that impacted you?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely. First off, I'm so grateful Mr Cathy lived into his early 90s and he actually died the week that we opened the Broad Rope location, um, back in 2014. And, um, I I'm so grateful. Regrettably, a lot of new operators, obviously they, they will never have the chance to, to have met, you know to, to meet Truett, and I'm glad that we did one of the cool stories that we had as a family we were going down for the Chick-fil-A peach bowl years and years ago and we were going.
Speaker 3:The corporate office is absolutely beautiful and amazing. Matter of fact, mr Cathy was so, so, wise and he's such a brilliant, he was such a brilliant businessman. Think about, in Atlanta, the world's largest or the world's most busiest airport, he might land within probably 15 to 20 minutes from the airport. Way back in the day, but I think it was I don't know how many like 60 acres, I believe, beautiful campus, just absolutely incredible there. And so, anyway, back in the day, when we were going down for the Peach Bowl, we we went to the corporate office and, as we're going in, mr Cathy true, cathy is walking in too were going in Mr Kathy. True, kathy is walking into and just is who he, he, he was. He said, saw our kids, our three kids, and said, well, you need to come up to my, my office. So we go up to his office and he's just, he's very kind and he's talking to them and just giving them a little bit of advice on, you know, as a, as a child, you know to make good choices and you know, and all of that, and just spending time and giving out, you know, the Chick-fil-A cow, mini moose and that kind of thing that was just really, really special. His life was so incredible though I mean it really was. I'm so grateful that the intention that he had on so many areas just like to take my kids and let's go to my office, let me spend some time with you was was very important. I think about his journey, though, in 1946, opening one restaurant with his brother and making that decision in that first week of business that we're gonna be closed on Sunday that set in motion something very powerful of rest and honor in God and that really set the tone for what we experience today. And again, a culture of care, a culture that people are important. God is so important. If we honor him, life will be great. So many people look at Chick-fil-A and go wow, third largest restaurant company in America, you're going international. Over 20 billion in sales, over 3,000 locations what an overnight success.
Speaker 3:1946, mr Cathy ran one restaurant for 21 years. 21 years doing the same thing every day, caring, caring for a team. I mean he had people that would stay work for him for over 30 years making fresh pies and sandwiches and what he created was absolutely incredible. He opened another restaurant but it burned down and he sold it and he operated one restaurant for 21 years. You know his brother was his partner. His brother died in a airplane crash.
Speaker 3:You think about the resolve, the resilience that I'm going to continue. You know what he did with the sandwich developing the chicken sandwich, experimenting with a pressure fryer, reducing the time that you would have to wait for us. I mean, as a pioneer, what he did was absolutely incredible in the culture. And then 1968, opening Greenbrier Mall. And then we opened Freestanders.
Speaker 3:And think about his decision-making and all the people that he brought in that were so good at their specific task to take the company to where it was. It's just incredible. But then I also think about, you know, in his 80s, to where it was. It's just incredible.
Speaker 3:But then I also think about you know, in his 80s writing books, became an author in his 80s, right, and one of the things that I love about his story is this is that he talked about the spirit of readiness. You know when you're ready, when you're ready emotionally and physically and financially, when you've grown your capacity to the point that you're ready for things, and when things come. It could be a really small thing, but that small thing can be huge. I think about when he the spirit of this is so incredible, the spirit of readiness, that he sees a child that doesn't have a home. That's not right. He finds a couple, a married couple too, and he buys a house and he starts the Windshake foster homes and now we have 12 of those. It's incredible. It's not a home like the foster care program that we're trying to farm these kids out. When they come in the program they want them to stay. Mr Cathy wanted them to stay until they were 18 and then wanted to help them through college and there's so many incredible stories around that I think about his.
Speaker 3:He was, when he was living, the legal guardian for over a hundred children the legal guardian. I have three kids, raising three kids, right, that was awesome. How about being the legal guardian for a hundred? That's amazing, right, and the impact that he had. But that's it doesn't stop there. He sees a team member that doesn't have money to go to college. So what do you do when you're ready and your capacity is expanded? What do you do? Well, you create a scholarship program and today we give millions of dollars back to our team to go to college. You can get that four times.
Speaker 3:That's probably one of the things that draws people to Chick-fil-A, in addition to the benefits piece we didn't talk about. But there's also in Northern Georgia, at Berry College. There was the school that didn't have funding and Mr Cathy goes there with his wife and what do they do? Because you have capacity to care. Now we have this incredible camp for kids that go in there. Right now they're learning character-based teaching in this incredible environment. We also have a marriage and family retreat. We have a marriage center there.
Speaker 3:We've had the privilege of sending some of our leaders, as they're about to get married, for Prepare to Last. It's an incredible weekend of preparation and that's open for anybody. My wife and I have gone and we were surprised at the 50 couples there. We were like, well, only Chick-fil-A people there, and we were surprised at the 50 couples there where there were, like we were like, well, only Chick-fil-A people. There is a national incredible marriage program. They even have a marriage intensive for those who are at the point of divorce and they've got this incredible recovery rate of marriages.
Speaker 3:And then you have the international program. You know, one of the things that Mr Cathy was so good about is facilitating dreams, and so I've had the privilege of not serving chicken there, but teaching in Turkey, the country of Turkey, in Brazil, in Peru, in the Bahamas. I mean, today we're digging wells in Haiti, today we're digging well, we're doing leadership classes for women in Saudi Arabia. We're not serving chicken there, doing leadership classes for women in Saudi Arabia, we're not serving chicken there, but we're expanding. What's part of that culture of care is simply this is the influence piece.
Speaker 3:So that's what Mr Cathy did and man, talk about inspiring, talk about a legacy, was just absolutely thrilling and I'm just so grateful that my kids had a chance to meet him.
Speaker 3:But I had a chance to meet him and you know, as I mentioned, we have a national conference that we, that we all, get to go to and they have great outside speakers and great um speakers from you know, actually internally in our, in our company. But when, when Mr Cass Kathy was living probably the last seven or eight years of his life, he was one of the last speakers and he would always ask this why not give your best? Why not give your best? And then that just lives on in our hearts as operators that every day I get to get up and get connected to this incredible legacy of not just sales and profitability but care is I, just I pinch myself every day. I can't believe I get to do this. That, for me, is just such a profound motivation to go and serve chicken and to connect with the team and stay aligned, because there's so much to be aligned around. I'm so grateful for this opportunity.
Speaker 2:Just how audacious those dreams are from Mr Cathy and his desire to chase it.
Speaker 3:Amazing.
Speaker 2:It is amazing. It's incredible to listen to just those things that you mentioned. Wow.
Speaker 1:I got a quick question, jeff, so we talked about the on-ramp of getting into this. You talked about the highway you've been on and all the different opportunities through Windshape and Berry College and the different scholarships. You know, if my math is right, you had 15 years of ministry before Chick-fil-a, right? Yeah, I'm an old cat man. Did you say you were a 28th year with Chick-fil-a?
Speaker 1:yes so you know, help us understand, maybe specifically to you. Or or how Chick-fil-a addresses operators as they look to transition, as they look to perpetuate. What does that process look?
Speaker 3:like, yeah, that's that's interesting. Um, yeah, I, that's interesting. Yeah, that's exactly where we're at. How long do I want to do this? How long can I do this? Chick-fil-a doesn't have a number out there that you have to add 65 or Not like a pilot. No, yeah, exactly, there's not a certain number, it's not a certain age.
Speaker 3:I think, more than anything else, as long as an operator is fulfilling the purpose and they're, they're very productive, um, and still engaged in this, um, I mean, I, I love to work. I'm not working on my golf game, um, I love to love to sell chicken. I love to be a part of this. Um, at some point I'm not gonna, you know, there's going to be a time when I'm not gonna, you know, no-transcript really finish seamlessly well, and I think, even today, you know, when you see a lot of executives, you know I just that's such a, that's such a motivating thing for me and, I think, for for for others, is that, um, I just want to finish so strong, you know, um, with my team, with um, with my marriage, with my, with my children and my grandkids, um, I think the legacy piece is just, it's more profound every day in my mind about you know, how many more people can we, how many more team members can we engage with?
Speaker 3:How many more people can we, how many more team members can we engage with, how many more can we prepare? And even in that transition, whatever that is, what does that look like and how do we do it in such a strong, profound way, is just really motivating to me, because, at the same time, the business is very challenging, and so, with technology and with all the things that are happening, you know, how do we, how do you stay relevant in that and that's just, I think, just a journey piece that I want to do well, and that's why, you know, I visit other people and that's why I still read, that's why I'm still educating myself on, you know, all of those pieces and cause I I definitely want to. I just want to finish well.
Speaker 1:And the Chick-fil-A model. Does the operators sell back to corporate or do they sell directly to an approved new operator?
Speaker 3:So one of the uniquenesses, the uniqueness about the Chick-fil-A model, franchising model is it's a very small capital investment to get into Chick-fil-A Very tiny, it doesn't really take much money to get in. It's very difficult though. Very tiny, it doesn't really take much money to get in. It's very difficult though. As a matter of fact, I think there are I think the last thing I heard I think there are a couple hundred thousand applicants annually for less than 150 opportunities and a lot of those opportunities are going to be internal anyway, like, like the leader that I had, that you know, chick-fil-a's got a really good program. Let's say that there's a program that they can take two to three years and work for Chick-fil-A, the corporate side, and travel and do grand openings, and it prepares folks for the operator opportunity. There are those that come straight out of stores and they're external candidates. So it's very difficult, it's so competitive. There are, like I said, about 200,000 applicants, I believe, and there's a very small amount of opportunity. So it's not the investment, the small capital investment, that Chick-fil-A is looking for. They're looking for the alignment with culture, with the entrepreneurial drive to do that and blending those two together, and so, yeah, it's an interesting process. I mean it really is. I mean, chick-fil-a is, especially today. It's a very, it's an incredible business, it's very. But what they're looking for is, again, not deep pockets, but they're looking for the leadership piece at the alignment piece and the entrepreneurial piece and, to answer your question, whenever that is, when operator decides to leave, they get that small capital investment that they had back and, like I said, they have this, this group of of of leaders that are fully trained to be, um, these operators that will flow in and take care of the business and get ready for the next operator. They have a seamless process for that. I mean the way that Chick-fil-A has grown. Their capacity is amazing, from everything from real estate to marketing, to HR and that's the thing that I keep mentioning, the part about being, you know, being in business for yourself, but not by yourself.
Speaker 3:I'm amazed that at the amount of support. If there's a question, any question that I have in the business, there's a group of individuals that will either come to and help me answer questions, you know, whether it's marketing or drive-thru. You know, recently it was awesome we had and this has been written about a lot just about the support of the drive-thru, but we had that at our Broad Ripple location the drive-thru team. The analysis they did was amazing. They literally you know, when we had questions about that they had a drone fly over Broad Ripple for about an hour and a half. They took that, they did a film study, linked it with our security cameras inside, looked at everything. I know there was a big article about this recently, but it was really interesting to see the pain points, the bottlenecks and everything else. Then they came to Indy and unpacked it for us and said, hey, these are the things you're doing. Well, these are things, are opportunities. Are you thinking about this? Are you thinking about that? So the amount of support is absolutely amazing and, as you saw that we were closed for 12 weeks recently at the crossing location oh, I noticed which was, oh man, it was a long 12 weeks.
Speaker 3:The support that they provide from a financial perspective is just absolutely stunning. I mean, it's really. They're an amazing company. They really are. They continue to make investments, because we had five years ago, we had just had a big remodel for eight weeks, and so they're just continuing to do it. Again, to answer your question, I own the business part. All those individuals work for me. I own the business, that intangible piece of running the business, and I take on all the liability of that. But they own the brick and mortar for this small capital investment. It's just a deal that's too good to be true.
Speaker 2:It's amazing have your uh children expressed interest in getting into the chicken business?
Speaker 3:yeah, they have from time to time. Absolutely they're. They're thriving in their own, in their own pursuits and I'm really proud of them. They're just they're, they're crushing it. They, they really are. I I would love that, my wife would love that, my wife would love that. I mean, it would just be a dream for them to be a part of that. At the same time, they're just, they're crushing it on their in their own experiences and their own pursuits and I'm just really, really thankful for them.
Speaker 2:That's great. I I wanted to ask you real quick about just COVID and how that changed your business from. I mean, gosh, pre-COVID, the inside of your building was just impossible to find a seat, and then people aren't allowed to come in. What I noticed, at least, is obviously the technology of being able to order mobily and deliver to the vehicles, obviously expanded drive-thru operations. So so how did COVID change your business? Like? What did that look like?
Speaker 3:Oh man, that was such a, not only for us but for you too, right, it was just such a. It's crazy. I think that we actually went through that, right. I still remember when, when the whole mandate came out for mask and there weren't mask available, my wife and I went to every Michael's store locally, fabric store locally, and bought as many bandanas as we can could at that point and we're creating our own mask for our team and that was so difficult and we did so many things.
Speaker 3:You know Chick-fil-A was so good working with, you know, for the center of disease control, being there in Atlanta and having partnerships there, that we could really kind of figure out what we needed to do operationally. There were, there were key initiatives that we had to do. It was crazy. Every hour of the things that we had, there were 14 things we had to do. You know where there's cleaning high touch items to. You know, temping your employees. So you first came in to all of it and I just think what we did, you know, just trying to provide care. But also it was so crazy. You know the the things we tried. You know from, you know, putting plastic in certain areas where they couldn't. You know they could distance themselves to. It was just a crazy deal. I was amazed at the innovation. You know we, you're right we we actually closed the, the, the inside dining, for a period, and so it was completely a hundred percent. You know, drive-through, and you're right, the, the mobile app was man, that was just an aid, that was just something that was just huge for us during that time. But I, I was amazed at the tech, at the, at the innovation of our team. When you're trying to get six feet of distancing and take a cash payment, if you remember, but they would stick this ax handle in your, in your car, right With a, with a credit card reader on the end of it, oh my gosh, are you kidding? I mean, they got so creative with it. Right, you know they wanted to honor the six feet, but they also wanted to help you with your payment and the mask and all of it was just so difficult, you know, and our sales just exploded during that time. I mean, that was such a pivotal piece for our company. But our two restaurants, I mean we grew by I think it was 28%, both of those. I mean, during that period.
Speaker 3:It was absolutely crazy and at the same time painful, you know, just trying to understand where people are. You know we had those moments. You know you would have a conversation about you know, hey, I really want to help you, we're going to develop you in this particular area, and you have that conversation and then they don't show up and they just quit. It's like, wow, you know, we just made an attempt to really try to help and people are just going through so many hard things mentally. You know, one thing I wish that we had it was just so hard even today. I think one of the things that we've learned from COVID is you know, you're really just trying to provide care. I wish that we had a better way of measuring where people are at, you know, and how we can respond, and I wish there was a gauge right and going man, I'm really good today, or I really need more encouragement today, and that's why I think it's just so important that our teams have had we just try to create those moments of care and openness. And what are you going through and what moments of brokenness are you feeling? Because it was so hard.
Speaker 3:Like I said, we lost our parents during that time, and how difficult was that. And um during covid, you know, and um so difficult not to be with your family members during that time and so, but our team dealt with that. You dealt with that. Um the business though it it forced us to some disciplines that were really, um, really profound as we came out of covid. The things that we maybe struggled with, um that they just became natural that we had to do with regard to the drive-thru and being outside and the innovation and curbside and all of those things, and so there's tremendous benefits from it. And Chick-fil-A, and obviously the guests really responded to that too, if it was helpful for them to be able to place their order, you know, through the app that has exploded Now, we have, you know, lanes in our drive-thru that is completely, you know, mobile only, and so it's just really amazing. You know how the guests have responded and how we have responded.
Speaker 3:I still think there's something, though, that you know post-COVID, that we're really trying to deal and dial in, how we can provide more care, because I still think that there's an isolation that folks are dealing with, even from a customer service perspective for a new wave of team members and now we're open and how to engage someone at a table and refreshing a beverage or taking a tray or asking if they're okay. Some of our younger team members struggle with that refreshing a beverage or taking a tray, or, you know, just asking if they're okay that some of our younger team members struggle with that. You know they were isolated from school and isolated from relationships and so just trying to help them with that has been a challenge. But these aren't things that are unique to us. I mean, I think everybody's dealing with it. You know the isolation piece and the post-COVID recovery that maybe we're not always aware of and how that manifests itself. I think it's just very, very difficult and remote working and everything.
Speaker 1:We recently hired an individual who chose not to go to college, but he was part of that cohort that essentially lost his high school graduation and I remember at that time kind of marking in my mind. I want to hire those individuals because they've got a chip on their shoulder, they had something taken from them and they need to have an opportunity to have something be given back. So it's exciting to think about those individuals now coming through the workforce. You know, in my infinite wisdom, as we were shutting down our office during that March of 2020, I swung through Chip-fil-A office during that March of 2020. I swung through Chip-fil-A and I'm quite surprised, jeff, that your sales weren't up more than 28%, because I personally bought 25 chicken sandwiches, took them home and told my wife we're set, we can get through whatever they do. Now, two weeks turned into a whole lot more.
Speaker 3:It didn't last very long.
Speaker 1:Thank you for supporting us. Thank you for supporting us.
Speaker 2:You guys are amazing. Todd's prepper kit includes the Chick-fil-A sandwich.
Speaker 3:I love it. I love it, man. You're amazing man.
Speaker 1:There was something that you talked about that all three of us agree on that. I want to make sure the listeners realize and actually take action themselves. You mentioned that you meet regularly and talk with and share abundantly with other operators and you do not view them as competition. While they could be viewed as competition, you view them as brothers and sisters and people who are actually more aligned to you than really anybody in your sphere. Nobody at your church, nobody in your neighborhood, nobody knows what it is like to be an operator except your wife and these other operators. And I think about Ben and I.
Speaker 1:In the last couple of years, each of us have joined two cohorts. One of them, for each of us, is more national in nature and is within our industry. The other one is more local in nature and more from a faith perspective, is more local in nature and more from a faith perspective. And so I just want, I guess, maybe a couple of minutes for all of us to just affirm to those people listening that are doing business and doing it alone those people you think are your competitors. They are not, and there is a real need to shift to that abundance mindset and realize you can relieve a lot of stress by realizing somebody else already has the answer. Somebody already has the document written, you just need to tweak it a little bit. Somebody already has the consultant that they've used and has been successful to solve that problem. I'm sure you've had many cases where you've had answers, questions answered by other operators?
Speaker 3:Absolutely no, that's a great insight and that's awesome for you. Applaud you guys for doing that too. No, it really is, and that's awesome for you. Applaud you guys for doing that too. No, it really is. And. But I think it's really intentional. It's choosing to, it's choosing to be there Cause I I can't speak for other operator teams, but I just I know that there is something special about when you decide and to submit to those around you. Like I said, no one understands your industry like those around you. Like that, no one understands an operator like an operator. There's just so much benefit to it because a sale is not worth the relationship. Hiring somebody else's team member is not worth it.
Speaker 3:I think it goes back 20 years ago that we took a trip to Chicago as an operator team and we took time to hear each other's stories and understand each other. And that moment, 20 years ago ish, it could have been 15, 20 years ago, but that time in our past, in the early days of going and really understanding each other and really affirming each other, and but it's also a commitment, right, I mean I'm I choose to humble myself and realize that yeah, I've been in the industry. I mean I'm honestly, I'm one of the old guys in the in the market right, we have new operators coming in. Those guys I can learn tremendous about they're. They're tremendous, they're, they're so good. They think differently and I can either be set in my ways or I can open myself up to great information and I have to do that. It's just really important. I tell you what I can do it alone, but why would I want to? There's just something so powerful about engaging in that. But it's being present and but it's a choice.
Speaker 3:And sometimes you know and I'm not saying that we're a perfect market and things go well Sometimes you have conversations. We did a promotion recently you know that I thought was going to go well that the guest had a different idea about it and took all those coupons we provided for this particular event it was supposed to be individually handed out took it to another store and got them redeemed immediately and that operator called me and I'm like wow, you know what? I'm sorry, you know that was not the intent of the program and what can I do to make this happen? And sometimes you have to have those conversations like or help me understand what happened there, because did you not know that was my team member and that kind of thing. But more than that, it's a commitment that I'm going to love, I'm going to care, I'm going to learn, I'm going to grow, and it's so good. It's just like what happens in my restaurant. When we're aligned If we're aligned as a market, my goodness, there's nothing we can't do together.
Speaker 1:It. There's nothing we can't do together. It's absolutely amazing. Beneficiaries are the team members. We, as business leaders, certainly benefit from having shoulders to cry on and people to help with difficult situations. I look at all the good ideas I've gotten and implemented in our team. It's been to the, to the, it's inured to the benefit of our team members. And so if you're a leader out there who's trying to do it alone, okay, don't do it for you, then Do it for your team. Care enough about your team to get the best ideas.
Speaker 2:That's good. I mean. Those peer groups have changed our business immensely, have helped Todd and I become better leaders individually.
Speaker 2:Interestingly enough it helped us be better leaders together, how to have conversations with each other, or you know how do we, how do we get you use the word alignment. I think that's great. How do we make sure we have alignment and just the encouragement from you know, locally it's Christian peer leaders and then nationally, industry leaders. Well, we're getting to the end of our show, jeff. Yeah, it's flown by, thank you, it has flown by, but we ask our guests two questions to close out the show, and the first question being what is a risk that you have taken that has changed your life?
Speaker 3:I think the biggest risk is just with our leadership team, is trusting them with the business and empowering them. I don't have to have, I don't have to be the smartest guy in the room, giving the business away and letting them thrive and sometimes they're going to do differently than I am, I would do, and we can always have a conversation about again realigning maybe some small things with that. I think the risk is again not only with the operator team, it's with my team. It's just trusting them and empowering them and training them and spending time with them, and it's been life-giving. It's been life-giving to them and I think that's why they stay for as long as they do, because this is not a fast food opportunity, this is a career managing a national brand. So I think just giving that away has just been really, really powerful and I do do it more and more and supporting them in that. I think it's just really important.
Speaker 1:That's probably why you have so many that have gone on to be their own operators and why your turnover is so low, and why you have so many long-term, full-time employees is because they have buy-in. That's great. The second question, jeff, is what is left yet undone or unfinished that you have the resolve to complete resolve to complete.
Speaker 3:Oh, that's good, I think. I think it's just the impact that we can have on our community and world. I would love to see you know what can we do more. You know we have partnerships with. This summer we do eight weeks, eight evenings with Brookside and giving to meals to underserved kids and for their programs and other things that we're doing.
Speaker 3:I would love for us to be more community involvement than we are right now. I think the biggest thing for me is a part of the legacy piece is what I can do for my team. I would love for them to take advantage of these opportunities of growth and learning. That's, I think, an unfinished part of the business. I would love for them to go more on trips internationally. I'd love for us to create more of our own little mission group that they can go experience and serve and give, I think. But it's thriving, it's helping them with their own personal development and taking the stuff that I wish I knew when I was 25 and 20 and applying that time and interest not only in their finances but in their own development and expanding their capacity as a dad, as a mom, as just an overall citizen, that we can really have that impact. I think there's just more for us to do creating those life skills that they can really enjoy.
Speaker 3:Because I think, when for Chick-fil-A, if and I've been talking a lot about this with our leaders it's possible to work at Chick-fil-A but not experience Chick-fil-A, and I don't want that. I want you to experience Chick-fil-A more than just the free Chick-fil-A sandwich on your meal. It's the benefit of this culture, because the culture will change you and it'll make you a better husband, it'll make you a better wife. It'll be. It'll make you a better parent, it'll make you a better person who's growing and you're expanding your capacity to lead, and and I want that, and that's always heartbreaking for me when, when, maybe team members don't catch that. So that's just a part of the I think, an ongoing thing that we're not done yet and we have more to do and we have more impact to make, and I'm excited to see what that's going to look like.
Speaker 1:And here I thought you were going to say you were going to get the band back together again.
Speaker 3:The band is gone. They're definitely retired.
Speaker 2:Jeff, thanks for joining us today.
Speaker 3:Man thank you.
Speaker 2:You know we've had. We've been walking alongside each other for 20 years and it was really cool to dig in and hear your story. And thank you to our listeners for joining us for another episode of Risk and Resolve. Catch you next time.
Speaker 1:Thanks for tuning in to Risk and Resolve. See you next time.
